toast21602 Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 The amount of misinformation accumulating in this thread is astounding... I don't even know where to start. i heard they ran out of cash already so they stopped blowing for the season... you mean 'misinformation' like that? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeer_tomas Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 (edited) Winter - "Water temp too high is a fancy excuse." The only snow Bear has made so far has been with water right around 50 degrees. It's almost as if people aren't aware of the weather they have personally been experiencing. 60 degree rainy days in November? How do you not notice this and take this into account? Mushy snow for a base layer??? Come on dood... really??? the ground hasn't even frozen yet. burton71 - "Looks like they laid down a nice amount of snow. Perhaps late week opening?" It looked that way from the cams and from the driveway but in reality most of what everyone saw was just a coating with scattered piles that are untouchable with a cat. HouseMuzik - "At 27 degrees humidity is irrelevant (and for three days at BC the temp fell below that)." "You have all the guns on, the pressure through those guns is going to be less than just a few blowing." "Good luck BC, you need it.. " When you see accuweather saying a low of 27 you have to understand that this early in the winter it might not get that cold until 3am and even then it could only last for an hour before temperatures start to rise again. Those few nights it got cold enough to make snow we maybe got 20 total hours of actual snowmaking in. Regarding water and air pressure... that is what's irrelevant. We used to have to be selective of where we made snow because of pumping capacities but with recent upgrades in pumps and fan guns this is no longer an issue. We can run every single gun at simultaneously with no problems. GrilledSteezeSandwich - "Didn't they have 3-4 good nights of snowmaking??" Again, we had 3 nights of 'good' temperatures but the actual window of snow making each night was not that great. Kyle - "They have thin coverage over every trail when they could have a decent base over a couple trails, open with that, then go from there. " Again... the amount you can see is deceiving. If you were to take a probe out there and measure the depth of some of the piles they might only be 2 or 3 feet deep at their peaks. Trust me... once you're in a cat... that 2 or 3 feet disappears reeeeal quick. Not to mention the fact that just to travel from pile to pile would make every bit of snow out a muddy mess. Winter - "Bear creeks guns are very intelligent and can fine tune pressures and air speed (among other factors) while the addition of Snomax extends the range at which good snow can be produced." Half right... The fan guns are extremely intelligent and it's only a matter of time before the become self aware, start to replicate and attempt to destroy the world. But seriously, our fan guns are pretty much the best you can buy. Snomax??? Not so much... I don't think we've used an additive in a really long time. Winter -"The manager (with a degree in zoology i might add) seems to not be steering the boat in the right direction at times but his inner staff of managers is affraid to go against his grain. It's getting to be a soft dictatorship there. Good luck to 'em, with all that $$$ behind them though, they don't necessarily wince at a bad opening or early closing. " Incorrect. This entire statement just illuminates your exteme distance from reality of what actually goes on at BC. With the exception of a few department heads that aren't necessarily involved in winter ops... Most of us are extremely passionate about skiing and boarding and want nothing more than to be open right now. Not only so that I can continue to pay my rent (obviously) but we all want to ride too!!! Edited December 16, 2011 by skeer_tomas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 Winter - "Water temp too high is a fancy excuse." The only snow Bear has made so far has been with water right around 50 degrees. It's almost as if people aren't aware of the weather they have personally been experiencing. 60 degree rainy days in November? How do you not notice this and take this into account? Mushy snow for a base layer??? Come on dood... really??? the ground hasn't even frozen yet. burton71 - "Looks like they laid down a nice amount of snow. Perhaps late week opening?" It looked that way from the cams and from the driveway but in reality most of what everyone saw was just a coating with scattered piles that are untouchable with a cat. HouseMuzik - "At 27 degrees humidity is irrelevant (and for three days at BC the temp fell below that)." "You have all the guns on, the pressure through those guns is going to be less than just a few blowing." "Good luck BC, you need it.. " When you see accuweather saying a low of 27 you have to understand that this early in the winter it might not get that cold until 3am and even then it could only last for an hour before temperatures start to rise again. Those few nights it got cold enough to make snow we maybe got 20 total hours of actual snowmaking in. Regarding water and air pressure... that is what's irrelevant. We used to have to be selective of where we made snow because of pumping capacities but with recent upgrades in pumps and fan guns this is no longer an issue. We can run every single gun at simultaneously with no problems. GrilledSteezeSandwich - "Didn't they have 3-4 good nights of snowmaking??" Again, we had 3 nights of 'good' temperatures but the actual window of snow making each night was not that great. Kyle - "They have thin coverage over every trail when they could have a decent base over a couple trails, open with that, then go from there. " Again... the amount you can see is deceiving. If you were to take a probe out there and measure the depth of some of the piles they might only be 2 or 3 feet deep at their peaks. Trust me... once you're in a cat... that 2 or 3 feet disappears reeeeal quick. Not to mention the fact that just to travel from pile to pile would make every bit of snow out a muddy mess. Winter - "Bear creeks guns are very intelligent and can fine tune pressures and air speed (among other factors) while the addition of Snomax extends the range at which good snow can be produced." Half right... The fan guns are extremely intelligent and it's only a matter of time before the become self aware, start to replicate and attempt to destroy the world. But seriously, our fan guns are pretty much the best you can buy. Snomax??? Not so much... I don't think we've used an additive in a really long time. Winter -"The manager (with a degree in zoology i might add) seems to not be steering the boat in the right direction at times but his inner staff of managers is affraid to go against his grain. It's getting to be a soft dictatorship there. Good luck to 'em, with all that $$$ behind them though, they don't necessarily wince at a bad opening or early closing. " Incorrect. This entire statement just illuminates your exteme distance from reality of what actually goes on at BC. With the exception of a few department heads that aren't necessarily involved in winter ops... Most of us are extremely passionate about skiing and boarding and want nothing more than to be open right now. Not only so that I can continue to pay my rent (obviously) but we all want to ride too!!! multi-member ownage. I applaud 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 Based on the forecast..they will be lucky to be open for Xmas. Is Mark still at Bear Creek??? All the former Bear Creek racers will prob be at Blue tomorrow. Former BC racers are mostly heading to Blue and Frost,, about 5 familes to Elk, a few to roundtop but sadly many just quite the sport. I know they have to balance their electricity use very carefully, essentially there is not enough power in that area for them to run every gun at once. Be patient its not even Christmas yet, anything pre Jan 1 in Pa is a bonus. Plenty of power unless something drastically changed since the re-building of the snow making system int he early 2000's. They lit off every gun they had one night and popped a transformer. The electric company was pissed (obviously), gave BC some grief and BC responded by threatening to install their own substation. The electric co. gave in a bit and allowed more usage via upgardes to their system in that area so as not to lose any money if BC put a substation in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mollyskeeze Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 comparing bear to boulder or any place in the pocs is like oil to water. it just wont happen. its been too warm down here lately. did they miss out on some chances to blow? yes. is there anything we can do about it? no. bear is doing the right thing by not announcing an opening date yet. if they say theyre gonna open monday and they dont then shit is gonna hit the fan worse then it is right now. like that time two years ago they closed without actually announcing a date and SHIT HIT DA FAN on their facebook. That was so funny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 Winter - "Water temp too high is a fancy excuse." The only snow Bear has made so far has been with water right around 50 degrees. It's almost as if people aren't aware of the weather they have personally been experiencing. 60 degree rainy days in November? How do you not notice this and take this into account? Mushy snow for a base layer??? Come on dood... really??? the ground hasn't even frozen yet. Winter - "Bear creeks guns are very intelligent and can fine tune pressures and air speed (among other factors) while the addition of Snomax extends the range at which good snow can be produced." Half right... The fan guns are extremely intelligent and it's only a matter of time before the become self aware, start to replicate and attempt to destroy the world. But seriously, our fan guns are pretty much the best you can buy. Snomax??? Not so much... I don't think we've used an additive in a really long time. Winter -"The manager (with a degree in zoology i might add) seems to not be steering the boat in the right direction at times but his inner staff of managers is affraid to go against his grain. It's getting to be a soft dictatorship there. Good luck to 'em, with all that $$$ behind them though, they don't necessarily wince at a bad opening or early closing. " Incorrect. This entire statement just illuminates your exteme distance from reality of what actually goes on at BC. With the exception of a few department heads that aren't necessarily involved in winter ops... Most of us are extremely passionate about skiing and boarding and want nothing more than to be open right now. Not only so that I can continue to pay my rent (obviously) but we all want to ride too!!! I appreciate you sticking up for your employer, it's a noble cause and quite frankly, I hope the best for BC and an expedient opening. But I know a bit more about mountain ops that most people in that I've been there and know a good deal about snow making, slope layout and prep and even details of the inner workings of several ski areas in the region. Many of your guns tune on the fly depending on temps and humidity, as you know which can change drastically in the course of a few hours. How can you expect a few snow makers to makes adjustments manually all night long on 80+ guns? And unless snowmaking has changed in the last 25 years, yes, you put down a wetter layer so it freezes and creates a hard insulating base before putting down the better snow to ride on. I'm not sure what your position is at BC nor do I care. Do a little research of your own and you'll find I'm right. Having said that, I will clarify that I believe everyone at BC is working towards the quickest opening possible but i think they could have been open at least partially by now, even if it was just a few slopes. Sometimes i think they operate like a nascar crew chief who takes a gamble on pitstops. They could pit for fuel so as to not run out but finish out of the top 10, or gamble they wont and win (or come in last). With the power of the BC guns, i would have gambled on the 'win'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 ^ Stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 I appreciate you sticking up for your employer, it's a noble cause and quite frankly, I hope the best for BC and an expedient opening. But I know a bit more about mountain ops that most people in that I've been there and know a good deal about snow making, slope layout and prep and even details of the inner workings of several ski areas in the region. Many of your guns tune on the fly depending on temps and humidity, as you know which can change drastically in the course of a few hours. How can you expect a few snow makers to makes adjustments manually all night long on 80+ guns? And unless snowmaking has changed in the last 25 years, yes, you put down a wetter layer so it freezes and creates a hard insulating base before putting down the better snow to ride on. I'm not sure what your position is at BC nor do I care. Do a little research of your own and you'll find I'm right. Having said that, I will clarify that I believe everyone at BC is working towards the quickest opening possible but i think they could have been open at least partially by now, even if it was just a few slopes. Sometimes i think they operate like a nascar crew chief who takes a gamble on pitstops. They could pit for fuel so as to not run out but finish out of the top 10, or gamble they wont and win (or come in last). With the power of the BC guns, i would have gambled on the 'win'. I'm pretty sure skieer thomas is the head chef in the cafeteria, so he gets all the inside info from the snowmakers on lunch break. Seriously though, I applaud bear for not trying too hard too early. I mean, did anybody step outside last night. It was 60 and I'm right down the road from BC. I wouldn't be surprised if they lost every bit of snow they blew already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 I'm pretty sure skieer thomas is the head chef in the cafeteria, so he gets all the inside info from the snowmakers on lunch break. Seriously though, I applaud bear for not trying too hard too early. I mean, did anybody step outside last night. It was 60 and I'm right down the road from BC. I wouldn't be surprised if they lost every bit of snow they blew already. I suspect most of the snowmakers are in bed by lunch time, but sure, news gets around. Head chef in the cafe? If that's true, he must have survived a few turbulent years of the food service chaos, and that's quite an accomplishment! Word has it they are trying to round up all outside entities and bring them in-house. The last culinary group was booted this year and is now supposedly being run by BC themselves. Same goes for the Pinnacle sports, now run by BC as well. Again, good luck to 'em! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 I suspect most of the snowmakers are in bed by lunch time, but sure, news gets around. Head chef in the cafe? If that's true, he must have survived a few turbulent years of the food service chaos, and that's quite an accomplishment! Word has it they are trying to round up all outside entities and bring them in-house. The last culinary group was booted this year and is now supposedly being run by BC themselves. Same goes for the Pinnacle sports, now run by BC as well. Again, good luck to 'em! Tis true, tom makes a Bomb Breakfast Burrito. You're preaching to the choir boss as I'm employed there as well. In other news, have ya heard JFK was shot?? How do you know so much about a resort you despise so much??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 This thread is pure Gold!!! isn't blue open or something, shouldn't you be skiing right now?? I gotta come up to blue and meet you man, you seem like an odd bird for sure. We can race down blue's steeps. Straightline, layin on the backs of the skis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VTSKI Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 This thread is pure Gold!!! DITTO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 Tis true, tom makes a Bomb Breakfast Burrito. You're preaching to the choir boss as I'm employed there as well. In other news, have ya heard JFK was shot?? How do you know so much about a resort you despise so much??? The reason i despise is that i know so much i guess, to answer your question. But to be a bit more specific i have gripes with a lot of ski areas, not so much in the snow sucks here or the park is lame there, but how things are run internally. I wont bore the list with details, but BC was taken over by the current owner through an un-ethical (but legal) coup back in 99. And while previous owner Bill 'B' (cant recall his exact name at this point) was no nice guy, he was desperate and looked towards BC's current owners for help which ended up quickly with a take-over. Hey, I still enjoy making a few turns there, but my home area has been Elk, and beleive me, they have their own list of faults internally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 I was at Blue earlier today..I'll be back Sunday AM if you wanna meet up. Have a safety meeting. Slightly tempting, I know you don't buy em but what does a ticket cost?? They got like two trails or what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 The reason i despise is that i know so much i guess, to answer your question. But to be a bit more specific i have gripes with a lot of ski areas, not so much in the snow sucks here or the park is lame there, but how things are run internally. I wont bore the list with details, but BC was taken over by the current owner through an un-ethical (but legal) coup back in 99. And while previous owner Bill 'B' (cant recall his exact name at this point) was no nice guy, he was desperate and looked towards BC's current owners for help which ended up quickly with a take-over. Hey, I still enjoy making a few turns there, but my home area has been Elk, and beleive me, they have their own list of faults internally. yeah I've heard that story already too. I don't mind though, business is business. Besides I kinda like the resort they have turned it into. If you stand at the lodge with your back to the hill it kinda feels like you're in some swanky VT or maine resort. Like I've honestly thought about spending the night there in the hotel, and I live 2 minutes down the road. Don't get me started on Elk. I still go there though and believe that it probably is the best mountain in PA. Well eastern PA. Did you used to run a resort or something, why so harsh on the internal workings of ski areas??? Or are you just the type of fella that gripes at dominoes while waiting for a pizza cause they're so disorganized??? $40...two trails from the top and one park merging into one trail at the bottom..almost double the vertical available as BC. 40 bones might be a stretch as I have a strange feeling I'm gonna end up at a peeler bar tonight at some point. Also the holidays are closing fast. I'll think about it though. I guess there is no way to get any kind of discount this early in the season huh?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinnyv11 Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 40 bones might be a stretch as I have a strange feeling I'm gonna end up at a peeler bar tonight at some point. Also the holidays are closing fast. I'll think about it though. I guess there is no way to get any kind of discount this early in the season huh?? That is a discount. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 That is a discount. haha coulda fooled me. I think I can get em cheaper than that through the ski club during the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 I never realized how cheap PASRs are. Hey not everybody gets a fat paycheck from daddy. Besides I'm really more of a newschooler than pasr so that should explain it. Two trails or two cases of yuenger is how I see that, priorities man. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 yeah I've heard that story already too. I don't mind though, business is business. Besides I kinda like the resort they have turned it into. If you stand at the lodge with your back to the hill it kinda feels like you're in some swanky VT or maine resort. Like I've honestly thought about spending the night there in the hotel, and I live 2 minutes down the road. Don't get me started on Elk. I still go there though and believe that it probably is the best mountain in PA. Well eastern PA. Did you used to run a resort or something, why so harsh on the internal workings of ski areas??? Or are you just the type of fella that gripes at dominoes while waiting for a pizza cause they're so disorganized??? BC is an entirely different world than what Doe was and you're right, it's knocked out of the park what one would expect of such a small hill. The hotel is top notch as well. My criticism of any business is based on how I've acquired and run mine. In my case there is luck and hard work to be successful, and then there is luck and deceit as to how BC did it. But whatever. Heck, Frost nearly went down with some bad real estate investments, Elk has some hard nosed owners who are sparring with the hard nosed owners of local real estate to the detriment of the skiing customers, Montage/Sno transition was a catastrophy because the county had special perks when it ran the ski area that the new owners weren't privy too... oh the list goes on and on, but hey, I'll be skiing in a day so i could care less. Just get the dern snow down, bring out the sun and proper adult beverage afterwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 BC is an entirely different world than what Doe was and you're right, it's knocked out of the park what one would expect of such a small hill. The hotel is top notch as well. My criticism of any business is based on how I've acquired and run mine. In my case there is luck and hard work to be successful, and then there is luck and deceit as to how BC did it. But whatever. Heck, Frost nearly went down with some bad real estate investments, Elk has some hard nosed owners who are sparring with the hard nosed owners of local real estate to the detriment of the skiing customers, Montage/Sno transition was a catastrophy because the county had special perks when it ran the ski area that the new owners weren't privy too... oh the list goes on and on, but hey, I'll be skiing in a day so i could care less. Just get the dern snow down, bring out the sun and proper adult beverage afterwards. Fair enough, I can see where you're coming from at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast21602 Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 Hey not everybody gets a fat paycheck from daddy. Besides I'm really more of a newschooler than pasr so that should explain it. Two trails or two cases of yuenger is how I see that, priorities man. you would love the park Blue has right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 you would love the park Blue has right now. Perhaps, honestly for working park crew I'm not really much of a jibhonk. I think I hit a total of ten rails last year. I like jumps more than rails, but still I've never even done more than a 540. I'm a tree skier, I just use NS to hook up with folks up and down the east coast to ski. I do wanna check out the competition though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HouseMuzik Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 FWIW.. we just got a message from Bear Creek here at the shop that they will not be open through at least Monday. Might be worth it to call method whose CAD is on the 23rd and see if they got a cancellation as well. Looks like whomever said of the post-Xmas opening may have been right... forecast is pretty bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted December 16, 2011 Report Share Posted December 16, 2011 I never realized how cheap PASRs are. nobody ever likes paying for lift tickets, I know I don't. I've had a season pass to somewhere since 2005. nothing beats saving up, shelling out all your cash, then having piece of mind knowing that you can ski as many days as possible for the rest of the season. it's not that we're cheap it's that paying to get on the hill once absolutely sucks. then that $40 lift ticket then turns into a $70 day, you've always got gas, for some people tolls, and then since you're probably gonna make the most of the lift ticket you'll wind up having to spend money on food. most are expenses we usually deal with every day out, but the added cost of a lift ticket really pisses me off especially when they're really aren't discounted much from the normal price. I know it's business, and that many people would gladly pay $40 to ski but for us it hurts because many of us can't be satisfied with one day on the hill....especially if that one day is costing me at least $60. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeer_tomas Posted December 17, 2011 Report Share Posted December 17, 2011 multi-member ownage. I applaud Honestly I wasn't trying to 'own' anyone. It just bugs me when incorrect information spreads like a virus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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